Interview with Kenji Nakamura "Exploring “Money and The Future through Anime"

This is an officially translated version of an article originally in Japanese.

The original can be found here

This translation was done by: Chiho

Exploring “Money” and “The Future” through Anime — An Interview with Kenji Nakamura, Director of Fuji TV's Noitamina Series C

Originally published on April 14, 2011 at 8:00 AM
By Akihiro Horiuchi, Business Media Makoto

 

Fuji TV’s late-night Thursday anime block “Noitamina” has produced numerous hit titles over the years. The name, a reverse spelling of “animation,” reflects the creators' desire to overturn conventional expectations of anime. This innovative programming slot has given birth to major works such as Honey and Clover, Nodame Cantabile, Eden of the East, and Tokyo Magnitude 8.0.

The latest addition to Noitamina, premiering Thursday, April 14 at 12:45 a.m. (1:05 a.m. for the first episode), is the original anime C, which centers on the themes of “money and the future.” The story follows a college student studying economics who becomes embroiled in a battle of transactions, using money loaned to him in exchange for the collateral of his potential future.

In recent years, stories revolving around money — such as Kaiji and Liar Game — have gained popularity. However, in the anime world, which often focuses on more fantastical themes, C stands out as a unique and unconventional project. What kind of vision lies behind its creation? We spoke with the series' director, Kenji Nakamura (41), to find out.

 

Inspired by How Many Remarkable People Exist in the World

— Why did you decide to make an anime themed around money?
Nakamura: The idea for C was born around January 2010, right after the Lehman Shock. It was a time when the economy was in a serious slump. Society felt dark and heavy — even the trains frequently stopped due to accidents involving people.

Now, economic downturns have become part of everyday life, more of a routine discomfort than acute pain. But back then, the rapid decline was deeply unsettling, and people were struggling to cope. Some even began saying things like, “Japan is finished,” in complete despair.

At first, I wasn’t necessarily aiming to tackle the theme of “money.” I was more broadly interested in economics. I envisioned something lighter than C, maybe a globe-spanning economic battle story.

To build the concept, we needed solid ideas — and for that, we began with research. I assumed that those who frequently appear in the media — writing articles or giving commentary — might not be able to speak freely due to their professional responsibilities. They probably hold back, especially if data isn’t fully confirmed. I thought that if we conducted off-the-record interviews, we might get to hear what they really think. That was the optimistic idea that got us started.

At the time, it was common to see experts and commentators on TV discussing Japan’s future. To be honest, watching all these people argue from their own perspectives just made me feel, “This is all a jumbled mess.” Everyone was speaking from within their own domains, but I didn’t see anyone laying everything out side by side and saying, “This is the most reasonable conclusion.”

I even hoped that I might come across someone — not in the media, not on TV or in newspapers — who truly had the right answers. But the more interviews I conducted, the more I realized, “There’s no such person in this world” (laughs).

— How did you go about your research?
Nakamura: At first, I looked into the history of money through literature. This was probably at the level of a middle or high school textbook — learning how money came to be, how its role has evolved over time. That gave me the foundation to start talking with people who are more knowledgeable.

Since we’re amateurs when it comes to money and economics, we didn’t know whose opinions were right. We didn’t even have a stance of our own, so we decided to turn that into a strength — we would approach a wide range of perspectives, from the very basics, and ask to be taught.

Interviews with Former Star Traders and Operators of NPO-Based Banks

— What kinds of people did you interview?
Nakamura: We spoke with a wide variety of people — from those in accounting and finance to politicians, former central bank employees, and university professors. We interviewed individuals who had found success within the current financial system, as well as people working outside that framework in NPOs. I was stunned by how drastically opinions differed from person to person. In some cases, we interviewed the same individual multiple times. Altogether, we conducted over 20 interviews between February and August 2010.

We started with an editor from a respected economics magazine. That person told me something very clearly: “There is no economist who understands everything about this world.” Economics is like trying to predict which baseball team will win the championship — people just say someone is “right” if they happen to make the correct prediction that year, but no one knows who’ll get it right the next time.

Of course, each expert has their own deep, specialized knowledge — but they’re like baseball commentators. They gather information, analyze data, and then say things like, “If it were me, I’d make this move,” or “Now’s the time to bring in that player.” That’s the nature of their commentary.

At the expert level, economics involves many different fields, including mathematics. But in the end, it's all about human behavior — psychological elements and complex, interwoven events. So it can never be perfectly predicted. It’s obvious, but I came to realize, “This isn’t like a chemistry experiment where you get the same result every time you control the conditions.” It took me a while to accept that we couldn’t make a simple, clean “fun story about economics” (laughs).

Through this early research, I ended up forming a connection with Naoki Osaka, the Deputy Editor of Toyo Keizai magazine, who later became an advisor on the anime's production.

Later, we had the opportunity to speak with a former star trader from a foreign investment bank — someone who had earned astronomical sums of money, at least from our point of view. When we visited, he treated us with surprising kindness. As soon as we stepped in, he said, “Get in here!” so we hesitantly entered, and the first thing he asked was, “So, what do you guys want to know?”

We apologized and said, “Sorry, we’re total beginners — please start from square one.” He fired back with, “What? Sit down and have some tea.” Then he came out with a huge pile of his published books, slammed them on the table, and said, “Start with these. Read them, then come back” (laughs).

That was our starting point. From there, we got to hear all kinds of stories — about currency exchange, and about things he’d experienced while working in the U.S. He talked about the kinds of discussions that take place among the top few percent of investment bankers, and how they move trillions of yen. He also described how much psychological pressure comes with handling such massive sums. It was truly fascinating.

As for the U.S., a financial superpower, he acknowledged that the country gets a lot of criticism, but he said, “Look, like it or not, this is the way the world works. If you come at it with naive ideals, you’ll get crushed. If you want to criticize, fine — but get strong first. You can’t have a fair fight without mastering the weapons your opponent uses. Right now, Japan’s getting played.”

He clearly felt deep frustration with Japan’s current state, and at one point, he even burst out, “Just let me handle it!” (laughs).

On the other hand, from the NPO side, we interviewed a representative from Mirai Bank Cooperative, an organization that operates as a kind of non-profit bank.

Mirai Bank and other NPO-based banks provide loans for environmentally friendly initiatives. For example, older refrigerators in Japanese households tend to consume a lot of electricity. So they offer loans to help people purchase new, energy-efficient models from local appliance shops. Refrigerators made in the past decade use significantly less electricity, so replacing them leads to substantial savings on utility bills. Mirai Bank structures its loans so that the repayments come from those savings on electricity.

With this system, even though users are technically repaying a loan, their monthly expenses don’t actually increase — it’s just that part of their former electricity bill goes toward the loan instead. It’s eco-friendly because it reduces power usage, and once the loan is paid off, people can use the money they were spending to treat their grandkids or start saving. The organization told us, “We’re not trying to take from anyone — we want to create systems where everyone can be happy.”

Their philosophy is, “If an action doesn’t solve at least three problems at once, it’s not good enough.” In this case, lending money helps boost sales for local appliance stores, reduces electricity use and CO₂ emissions, and also earns a modest return (3% annual interest) for the lender.

However, because these NPO banks aren’t officially recognized as legitimate financial institutions yet, they’re still treated as if they were consumer lenders. This means, for example, that borrowers can’t even get cash cards. The organization had proposed policy changes during Prime Minister Yukio Hatoyama’s administration to prevent this, but unfortunately, Hatoyama himself stepped down. We happened to be conducting interviews right around that time, as they were wondering what to do next. We parted ways with the words, “Let’s hope things work out somehow.”

The former trader and the NPO banker I mentioned earlier are headed in completely opposite directions, and their views are probably irreconcilable. Still, both were filled with a sincere desire to make Japanese society better, and talking with them gave us a real sense of hope. We were moved to see so many talented, knowledgeable people who genuinely want to contribute to society — people honing their skills and waiting for their moment to make a difference.

Interestingly, despite their differing ideologies, many of the people we interviewed expressed the same concern: that Japanese people aren't making any real choices.

As a nation, Japan stands at a crossroads. One path offers a life that’s peaceful, safe, and happy — but poor. The other is exciting, intense, and chaotic, but leads to a stronger, wealthier society. Yet Japan hasn’t clearly chosen either path.

Ideally, those who understand the global situation would inform the public and say, “This is the direction we need to go.” But too many are caught up in the short term. Our interviewees lamented the lack of political leaders or public figures who can paint a vision of the distant future and demand the public to make a choice.

The essential point is this: “There’s no middle ground for the future.” If we keep sitting on the fence, we’ll just drift into decline. We have to actively choose one way of life or the other — and the window for making that decision is closing fast. The future must be consciously designed now, or it’ll be too late.

As we listened to more people, I felt something profound — many of them carried a sense of purpose so strong, it was as if they could say, “If I could just accomplish this, I’d be satisfied even if I died.” I found that kind of conviction incredibly inspiring, and it made me think: maybe that is the true theme of C.

Also, when I looked around at the world today, I started to wonder: why is it that I can’t imagine today’s 3-to-5-year-olds being happier than we are 20 or 30 years from now? My parents’ generation is now in their 70s, and I can sense in them a real desire not to become a burden on their children.

Before starting work on C, I hadn’t given much thought to this kind of atmosphere in society. We, after all, live in the two-dimensional world of anime. It’s a form of entertainment — like a court jester, it exists slightly apart from reality. That distance is part of what gives anime its charm.

During one of our interviews, someone said, “Do you know why Japan’s mountains are still so lush and green, while Europe’s are bare?” Forests take 200–300 years to fully mature. Back in the Edo period, when people cut down trees for use, they also planted new ones, even though they wouldn’t benefit from them in their own lifetime. That’s the kind of culture we need to rediscover — one where we pass something on, not for ourselves, but for someone in the future.

But now, we’re cutting down all the trees planted by our elders. We’re consuming resources recklessly and passing on debt to future generations — economically, environmentally, and socially. Are we really okay with this?

That question has grown huge in my mind. In a time where just surviving each day feels like a struggle, why do we still reach out to help others? Why do we feel compelled to give something to someone we’ve never even met? I think C is structured around exploring that very sense — the idea that this could somehow become a compelling drama (laughs).

So even though the story of C takes place in an alternate world called the “Financial District,” where battles are fought, there’s a secret thread connecting it to reality. If we can tell this story right, I believe we might help broaden the scope of what visual media can accomplish in Japan.

“It’s Not Enough to Just Create What Comes from Within Us”

— For your past works, did you also place a strong emphasis on research?
Nakamura: Before C, I directed the anime Kūchū Buranko (2009), which was based on a novel by Hideo Okuda — a powerful story that had won the Naoki Prize. It dealt with mental illness, and since someone close to me had passed away due to such an illness, I felt strongly that this wasn't a subject to be treated lightly. I believed we had to know the reality behind it, so I committed to doing proper research.

I didn’t want to hurt anyone with something that was meant to entertain. I wanted to know, “What kind of portrayal could end up hurting someone?” When something airs on TV, people can end up watching it by chance, even without meaning to. And we must avoid spreading misinformation or reinforcing prejudice, so I decided to research as deeply as possible. I spoke in detail with professionals involved in the latest psychiatric treatment practices — how they think, how they approach patients, and how they conduct therapy — and their insights became a valuable reference.

After that experience, when it came time to create a new original work, I thought: “Maybe it’s time to stop creating only from what’s inside us.”

All we really have is our craft — the ability to make anime. But I believe anime has unique strengths: it can soften complex topics and deliver everyday truths with clarity. One of my personal missions is to open those strengths to people outside the anime industry. That’s why this time, I wanted to go hunting outside our own heads for the story, and research became a central pillar of the process. I hope to continue working that way in future projects too, when the opportunity arises.

— So from the start, C was planned as an original anime?
Nakamura: Yes, it was completely decided from the beginning — in fact, we were the ones who were confused and asked, “Wait, there’s no source material?” (laughs)

A “Sweet” Entry Point

— After all that research, why did C end up being a battle anime?
Nakamura: At first, we thought of using economics and finance as the theme. Then we narrowed it down to currency. Eventually, we decided to just broadly center the story around money.

During that process, I read manga about loan sharks and gambling-themed stories like Kaiji. But many money-themed works tend to focus on how “money drives people mad,” and we didn’t really want to go in that direction.

We wanted something serious, but with an upbeat tone. I didn’t want to make something that would leave the viewer with a furrowed brow. Our aim was to create a work that had a soft, sweet entry — like a dessert — so that people might start watching thinking it's just a cute anime, only to find themselves drawn into a surprisingly hard-hitting story.

That’s why, truthfully, I don’t really want C to be viewed strictly as an “economics” or “finance” anime. I think people should just enjoy it as a battle anime. Then they might think, “Huh, this show keeps mentioning things like growth rate, M&A, and EBO.”

(EBO = Employee Buy-Out, where employees acquire control or ownership of their company.)

For people already familiar with finance, those M&A terms are probably common knowledge — but for others, they may sound completely foreign. On the flip side, I hope that viewers who are familiar with finance will laugh and say, “What kind of idiot turns M&A jargon into anime attack names?”

We want people to enjoy the creative adaptations. For example, how we represent corporate buyouts or shifts in ownership within the context of battles. We’ve been bold with our interpretations. If a middle schooler watches C now, and years later ends up in a university economics department, I’d love for them to realize, “So that’s why they did that! What a dumb idea — but kinda clever,” and piece it all together. I don’t want to be heavy-handed — I just hope C can be a starting point for sparking curiosity in economics.

— In the Noitamina block, there have been many socially aware titles, like Tokyo Magnitude 8.0 (which depicted a major earthquake hitting Tokyo) or Eden of the East (which tackled AR and NEET issues). Was that social consciousness part of C’s concept?
Nakamura: Not at all. It’s not like we felt pressure to handle social themes just because we were part of Noitamina.

— What was the Noitamina producer’s reaction when you proposed an “economic-themed battle anime”?
Nakamura: He just laughed out loud.

Our team had about seven or eight different original anime proposals at the time — some were more cartoonish, others were quiet and serious, with a wide range of themes. We spent about a month in heated debate, and in the end, C was the one we landed on.

— Considering Fuji TV’s past with the Livedoor incident, I thought they might resist doing a show that touched on the stock market or finance.
Nakamura: Actually, one of the producers even said, “Why don’t you try interviewing Takafumi Horie, the former Livedoor CEO?” But the timing didn’t work out, and we never got the chance to meet.

Noitamina Feels Like TV

— You mentioned earlier that you hope C serves as a kind of introduction to economics. But from a business standpoint, what would success look like?
Nakamura: When I first became a director, I was pulled aside and told exactly how much money is invested in making a show. Like, “Now that you’re a director, you need to understand what that means.” It was a bit intimidating — like, “You get it, right?”

I’m not exactly the most dependable person (laughs), so I’ve been fortunate to have kind mentors look out for me. My directorial debut was in Noitamina, and I really do feel like Fuji TV helped raise me. When I heard the financial breakdown, I thought, “Well, yeah, that makes sense.” I did my best to take it all in and understand it.

In the past, we used to be told to care about ratings — not so much by the TV network itself, but by the production companies. Nowadays, that kind of pressure isn’t as common.

— So if ratings aren’t the main goal anymore, what is? Is it about having social impact?
Nakamura: If I were to put it in idealistic terms, I’d say that Noitamina helps prevent the anime industry from becoming too uniform. It encourages diversity by allowing room for experiments and ideas that go against the grain.

There aren’t actually that many genres in anime that are guaranteed to sell. Noitamina intentionally turns its back on those, and makes quirky, offbeat works instead. I think that appeals to people who feel a bit out of step. There are probably viewers who say, “I don’t watch other anime, but I’ll check out Noitamina.” I’ve even had older people tell me, “I don’t normally watch anime, but I watched your show.”

Of course, those people don’t buy DVDs or post on the internet — they’re part of the silent majority. But the fact that they’re looking forward to each broadcast — that makes Noitamina feel more like a traditional TV show. Even though the business model is supposed to be about selling home media like Blu-rays, it really has the atmosphere of a TV program.

— Like Fuji TV’s old slogan: “If it’s not fun, it’s not TV”?
Nakamura: It’s more like this: there’s definitely a kind of unspoken pressure — “Don’t make something boring that feels like it could’ve come from anywhere.” It’s like, “Make something only we could make.”

Playing the Role of a Constructive Fool

— How has the Great East Japan Earthquake affected anime production?
Nakamura: Some staff members had family who were affected. There were also times when we were so overwhelmed by the news coverage that we couldn’t focus on our work. At the studio, there were even discussions like, “Is making anime really what we should be doing right now? Shouldn’t we be out there helping?”

During a recording session shortly after the earthquake, the entire cast and staff observed a moment of silence together. I suggested it, thinking, “Some of the cast might have loved ones affected too — it might be hard to focus right now. So let’s all take a moment and pray.”

You could say that even the content of the show has been impacted. We haven’t made drastic changes to the story, but we’re being much more cautious about visual direction, language, and emotional expression.

— Water effects are often used in action scenes.
Nakamura: Right. But if something in the show could cause emotional pain, we’d change it without hesitation. Not begrudgingly — we actively want to be considerate.

— Still, even as some at the studio are saying, “We shouldn’t be making anime right now,” you’re continuing to do exactly that. What gives you that sense of purpose?
Nakamura: I said this during the day we held the moment of silence, but I’ve had hard times in my own life. There were moments when I felt physically unwell, went in for tests, and seriously thought, “What if I have a life-threatening illness?” It was terrifying.

In the end, I was fine — but in those moments, anime helped take my mind off things. It helped ease the pain, even if just for a little while. That’s what I believe anime is for. It gives people something to look forward to — “I’ll go to work today because a new episode airs tonight.”

If even the healthy people start to fall into despair, that’s dangerous. So we, the creators, will carry on like we’ve taken no damage at all — like we’re totally fine — and just keep making our work. Of course, we’ll be careful not to overstep. But I want to play the role of a “constructive clown” — someone who uplifts society while making people smile.

Just like how kids affected by the disaster can smile while watching Anpanman, I believe that’s where the unique meaning of our work lies. We’re making C in the hope that it can help someone — even just a little.

— After the earthquake, people even posted things like, “I can’t die until I see the final episode of Madoka Magica.”
Nakamura: Exactly — that’s what really matters (laughs). That’s the essence of anime. And not just anime — movies, music, stand-up comedy… the things that “you don’t need to live, but life feels better with them” — I think those are the truly special things. I hope C can be one of them.